Hi Conny,
great, I hope you are not irritated by the deadline, here are some suggestions how to cope with the demands according to " 1) eGroupware20 returns as part of eGroupWare". I hope they will help in order to come together again.
a) That it is currently experimental code from a subset of eGroupWare
developers.
write an official mail to the mailinglists stating this, change the text of website egroupware20 to make this clear, perhaps it would be wise not to use egroupware20, but something like visionfor egroupware20 etc.
b) That it does not necessarily represent at its current state a new
eGroupWare version, a future release or the future of eGroupWare. This
will be determined at a later date due to the enormity of the potential
change to project-wide operations as well as its effect upon our
customer base, whether or not they are consulting clients of our
developers or other project members.
write this in official mail, too and on your website. Perhaps you shouldn’t insist on a vote on a certain date. You are making experiences with new technologies, which are imho really needed for future egw. But what do you want the people to vote on? If they like the look of a prototype? Of course you can check some technologies. And if, after you showed the possibilities of the new programm, there still is now way to integrate some of those in egw, you can insist on rewriting egw. If you have finished rewriting egw, which will take at least 1 more year, with basic features, than you can call for a vote in order to make it become an new official version. Or perhaps you can’t I don’t now about the community rules for egw. but this vote would be something I would understand. I really appreciate the effort to enhance egw with new java technologies, I think this is the way to go …
So keep on posting your experiences and showing the demo to the community, it will profit from this, but don’t make people think, this is the new 2.0 version.
c) That the selection of technologies and coding methods used in its
design should give consideration to our current development community.
This may become something that we will need to maintain as a community
effort in the future, assuming it will be accepted as a future version
of egroupware by the community. Preferably, this should be handled as a
working group with agreed membership to avoid the need for a
project-wide votes on every single change, which may tend to slow the
progress of development.
You are having lot of work coding the demo at the moment. If you realy want this to become the base for a new egw in the future, the above mentioned coding methods and technologies are realy important. After you made some more experience, I think you could contribute to such a working group. You can’t just define the offical new methods without asking the community. You can do this to try new things out, only for the proof of concept, as you are doing at the moment
d) That eGroupWare is more than just the name and a core functionality.
We strive to maintain variety and open architecture. It would require a
huge consensus to change this into a more narrowly focused software
project to the exclusion of some peripheral applications.
Imho this is the philosophy of egw. There is nothing you can do about it. You can’t change it yourself, but you don’t need to do anything about d), just keep in mind developing your “prove of concept” how to make it more open.
e) That it uses the existing project infrastructure including svn, the
website, mailing lists, etc., to which all other project members may
have access. Typical access controls may be used to limit write access,
but for the most part our usual method of staying out of each other’s
business should continue to work.
You already said something about svn, it’s now the others turn to answer. Imho you should close your own mailinglists, they are not very active anyway. It realy look very “forking” to make own forum, wiki, and so on. Imho you could leave the wiki, but this perhaps has to be discussed in detail. Use the developer mailing list for your “vision egw 2.0 status mails”, don’t post on the user lists, because it is a developers discussion. You should thing about canceling the egw20 website, perhaps using the egw-wiki. Imho you should change the domain-name and coul leave the wiki.
f) This new working group must balance the desires of any sponsor with
the needs and wishes of the project, including its administration,
developers and customers. This should always be a primary consideration
when working on the core API.
Okay, there is no direct thing to do here. If there are more direct accusations, which have to be discussed, they should be mentioned openly. It sounds a little like “you aren’t balancing those things at the moment”. But as long as there is nothing more than a very general statemant here, you can just state that you agree in an official mail.
About your wish, that someone else than Ralf should moderate. Moderate what? Is there already an official discussion? I think there has been a decision and about the details how to comply with the demands according to “1) eGroupware20 returns as part of eGroupWare”, you could call for moderation. According to another mail, this issue is already under discussion. Perhaps it would be wise to stop the speed of “blaming Ralf”, this is nothing to deescalate the situation. I think most both views have already been mentioned and everybody can make his own picture. No need to find the person, who is guilty.
about the deadline: I was little irritated by the deadline, because there are no details about, what and how the demands have to be met and what will happen, if there is a delay. Not realy deescaling, but anyway:
It think it would be okay, if you state, that you want to meet the demands accoring to 1) and you make some suggestions how to do this. Perhaps you already do some small things till Monday evening (like stating a) and b) in an official mail and on your website.
Finaly, we are glad that the situation turned this way. We hope that our
commuity now, as the situation is adjusted, gets back their confidence
into the eGroupWare project.
me too
Frank
Ralf Becker schrieb:
This statement is based on the admins understanding of the eGroupWare
project and it’s constitution: www.egroupware.org/constitution
We acknowledge and appreciate the intentions of the people behind
eGroupware20 to improve the eGroupWare code.
However, we cannot allow the use of the name eGroupWare or eGroupware20
outside of this project, as it implies that it is an officially
sanctioned part of the eGroupWare project.
The current eGroupware20 movement is not officially sanctioned, which
leaves only two possible alternatives:
- eGroupware20 returns as part of eGroupWare
=======================================
It acknowledges a few important points with regard to its public
appearance, representation and operations:
a) That it is currently experimental code from a subset of eGroupWare
developers.
b) That it does not necessarily represent at its current state a new
eGroupWare version, a future release or the future of eGroupWare. This
will be determined at a later date due to the enormity of the potential
change to project-wide operations as well as its effect upon our
customer base, whether or not they are consulting clients of our
developers or other project members.
c) That the selection of technologies and coding methods used in its
design should give consideration to our current development community.
This may become something that we will need to maintain as a community
effort in the future, assuming it will be accepted as a future version
of egroupware by the community. Preferably, this should be handled as a
working group with agreed membership to avoid the need for a
project-wide votes on every single change, which may tend to slow the
progress of development.
d) That eGroupWare is more than just the name and a core functionality.
We strive to maintain variety and open architecture. It would require a
huge consensus to change this into a more narrowly focused software
project to the exclusion of some peripheral applications.
e) That it uses the existing project infrastructure including svn, the
website, mailing lists, etc., to which all other project members may
have access. Typical access controls may be used to limit write access,
but for the most part our usual method of staying out of each other’s
business should continue to work.
f) This new working group must balance the desires of any sponsor with
the needs and wishes of the project, including its administration,
developers and customers. This should always be a primary consideration
when working on the core API.
OR
- eGroupware20 goes its own way as a new project
=================================================
a) This new project should select a new name not containing the name
egroupware or suggesting any relationship to our current efforts.
b) This new project should discontinue the use of domains containing the
name egroupware.
c) This does not necessarily mean that the two will never merge again or
otherwise be affiliated.
We hope for a peaceful resolution to this situation which allows all
current project members to continue to work on the future of the
eGroupWare project.
The eGroupWare admins
Ralf Becker, Pim Snel, Miles Lott
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[/quote]
